Amazing that everywhere else you can run this equipment but here. These things are all over Europe and a great tool.

They are to heavy for our highway's, plus most of our ready mix company have already tryed their hand at owning pump

biged 

 mix company have already tryed their hand at owning pump?
 what went wrong?

concreteluvr

I do not understand, because it is beautiful toys that you may work.

If the ready mix plant has a pump, then the customer says" I'll buy your concrete if you pump for free".  Most RM plants don't want to have apump and then have their salesmen promise it on more jobs than they can handle.  Plus, if it's not their pump and it won't pump, they can always blame "The GD pump!"  An additional reason is they won't pay an operator enough, or they'll work him so hard, he won't stick around.

"To heavy for our highways" the BIG COUNTRY cant have a Pumi runing on the highway ! You travel to the moon.... What World We live in ?

Most of the US only allows 18 wheelers for regular transport trucks.  And only recently have some states been allowing triple axle trailers.

In Saskatchewan, we allow Tri-Drive trucks, and Super-B trailers. (first trailer tri-axle, second on a 5th wheel is a tandem, but you can get a special permit on certain routes to go with 2 triple trailers.

There is now a proposal to test three 53 foot triple axle trailers on the route between the 2 major cities - Regina and Saskatoon.  They will be about 180 feet long!!  I wonder how that will be in a 40 MPH (70KM/h) side wind?

Of course a lot of mixers in the 80's -90's were tandem steer, tandem drive, and now there are Tri-drives and some T/A steer and Tri-drive as well.  Booster axles fell out of favor YEARS ago in many places, although they are still recognized under annual weight permits.

We also have trailer mixers too.  T/a and tri-axle, with tandem and tri-drive tractors pulling them.  I've even seen a couple 'pup' (or pony) mixers (trailers on a pintle hitch), but I think they'd be unstable as hell on corners if you were not very cautious.

The pumi's would only be able to carry maybe 2 cubic meters (2.6 cu yd) not an economical proposal.

Yes. These comments are all the right replies. BUT. What I was trying to say is like the others. 

Why is it accepted in other areas and not here. There are many ready mix people that are successful pumping concrete. This unit is mounted on a mixer.  Just like not so long ago. We had mostly rear discharge mixers. When the front discharge mixers came into the game if you requested a front discharge from a plant that had both front and rear  you had to pay a premium for the front mixer till they became mostly a standard in most parts of the country.

Change. We do not accept change like most other parts of the world. This Pumi type unit would be a huge asset if we would just give it a chance and could get it road approved.

Need to follow one like I did for a few days and see.

Garcia,

It is a huge Weight issue. Maxon and Mc Neilius tried to do a Cifa unit with a McNeilius Mixe in the later 1990's and weight was an issue like you had brought up on the Mack Truck a few weeks ago.

In Canada where they will accept new technology more then we it did not meet the frost laws for certain months. If not mistaken I think it was sold but had to go back because of weight.

I agree with you Garcia. Especially for House foundation applications. To pull a 28 or 32 meter up to a house foundation and footing would be great. Easy to move and set up as well if needed on site.

Inside for Mezzenine pours, loading dock and smaller pours. Just awesome.

Garcia, Vasa, Dip, and the rest.

Why do you think you do not have Front Discharge Ready Mix trucks in Europe? Why would the ready mix owners there not want to explore this since it is so successful here in theStates?

what you can do with a Front Discharge Ready Mix truck also can with a normal mixer.
that's why you rarely see them in Europe.

Not really Garcia. Have you seen the fronts in use? I admit that you can do the jobs but they go places with the Six wheel drive that rears counld not think of. Literally a front can pour a side walk and other things for a finisher. The shut is controlled from inside the cab. You do not need the mixer driver or a laborer to control the shut.

Watch some video in action. They are great. Still love the Pumi Idea. But these fronts are great too.

I don't understand the weigth issue thing. Here in Norway we have serious weight limits. The biggest pump in the country today is 42m.   32tons is the max. 4 axels.  There was one 52m in Oslo but I heared they had to sell it because they couldn't drive it on the road anymore..

But we have loads of 24m and 28m pumi's.. Our pump company owns 6 pumi's and 5 normal pumps..  all the concrete factorys have 3 or 4 pumi's  They can load 5m3. They are populair...

What does a front discharge mixer cost compared to a normal one mounted on a MAN or Scania for example? And what brand is the truck itsself? Do we have service points for them? Its not MACK is it?? 

concreteluvr, I believe what you are thinking about was PM's venture into an American Pumi. I was the project leader and we displayed units in 1999 and 2000 shows. We started with Milwaukee based Rexworks and then with McNeilus. Last I knew two of those machines were still in the field.

There are probably a dozen or more reasons (beyond the downturn back then) why it never took off here. The most significant:

- As mentioned earlier, the US weight laws are not favorable. They are good for a pump truck, or a mixer truck, but the weight of both is too much. The weight of the boom and structure effectively replaces at least 4-5 yards of concrete allowable capacity. States also do not like to give permits for a variable load. The pumps can get overweight permits because they are a fixed load. So taking a half load to the site is not really economical.

- With this capability issue, the longest boom I know of on any Pumi in the world is 31 meters, but most are mid 20's in length ... this is limiting in the work it can do. 

- Operators: I have seen many comparisons on this site about pumpers vs. mixer operators ... not getting into that bashing party, but suffice it to say the impression shared by most is neither wants to (can do) the other's job. They also typically work in different unions. Again, not making judgements here, but how well would that work?

- Cleaning out: once the Pumi's load has been used, it has limited options for clean out if it is needed right then for pumping. In today's world of the cleanout being a distance away from the set-up, that is troublesome.

- Economics: Even my friends at McNeilus will tell you a mixer trucks is a commodity ... relatively common and inexpensive. Now you want to sell what is perceived as a cool but very expensive mixer truck ... at best it has a very limited market niche.

PM Eng. Thats right. It was Putz also. You are right. Maxon did try one as well.

You give great input for sure. Thank You. But I still see this as not just a cool idea but a useful tool. I have been to Europe and done things with many manufactures there in our industry. I myself believe there is a place for this Pumi in this market. We may never see it happen. But after seeing it work there in many ways. I like it.

Your point on the operators. Strong Point PM. Thanks for your time and I cannot dispute your points and facts but remain pro on this.

We have frontdischarge mixers in USA on our plants there . The reason We dont have them in Sweden is that We had a craschtest on the cabs om trucks, ROPS and FOPS like they have on AD:s and excavators wheelloader and so on . And the front discharge did not pass the test , but now is the test gone , so it is probably "only" the brakerules , 24 voltsystem , lights and others "small" things to change . So I think the market is to small to get a manufactuer to change all those things to sell so few trucks in Europe . We do the sidewalks with PUMI and earn more money than a RM . But most RM-trucks has camera ower the chute and sit in the cab when deliver mud or the whole RM-truck is driven buy the remote . We dont have pumps in USA only RM-trucks , but who knows what happends on that point . Our name in USA is TCG Thomas Cement Group , I have seen pic's of pumps that got mud from TCG here on CP.COM

Know the company VASA. Interesting that the cabs do not meet crash test. I know there is not much to them at all. Just about a sheet metal box so your comment is not hard to believe.

Again. Love the Pumi Idea. Do you guys run any of the Waitzinger Mixer pumps at all?

We dont have anyone . I think it only is one "pumi" from Watzinger that operates i Sweden , a 29 meter . And 3-4 boompumps.... Maybe some I forgot... Tobias Watzinger has been at our Company and tried to sell some pumps and Pumi . But it is a "small" Company and the Swedish sales and repair Guy is "old" , Does He get someone who wants to take ower ? But they are great pumps ! I would happily run one if We bought one .

I want to see a pump mounted on a front discharge chassis!

concreteluvr

don't get me wrong to say that the work with a normal mixer also comes ready

I am with you Garcia. Have a great week.

I work in British Columbia Canada for a ready mix company, I operate 1 of 13 boom pumps for them, we also pump for other ready mix companies. BC has the heaviest allowable freight laws, we run as high as 160,000 lbs North of the 47th p.

We can also permit up our drives, law states steering has to be legal but drives can be permited up, but there is a bridge law involved, they want groups of axles in 8ft groupings at certain disance, this makes it hard, to run equiptment.

The US allows larger groups and not as legal here, we have to haul less on a US spec tridom.

Tridom steer tridom drives tridom everywere, but have to be spread out. A mixer pump combo would look like a 52m boom pump.

Yes. Understood Seedless. And in Europe they run on four axles.?? Two steer axles in the front and tandems on the rear.???? Where Garcia and Vasa are they have basically the same frost conditions and weather as you.

concreteluvr, just an fyi, confirmed with Bill Maxon, that was a unit solely from Cifa and followed the unit solely from PM in early/mid 90's ... there was no collaboration between Maxon & Cifa with McNeilus, though there was lots of 'talk' back then, especially by Frank Guffrie who used to own Rexworks.

Thanks PM. I was at Rex at one point during that. Yes I looked back at some stuff as well and remember now the PM/McNeilius thing. I know in Italy at the time CIFA in and out of recievership with the Government. I was in Italy with a fellow named Poalo Maggi who was the Italian Rep working with Bill and I thought the unit for the Mix had been built but could be wrong.

Thanks for the info. Again. I personally like the unit. How is Maxon doing these Days. THey do some neat stuff.